Star Talk ☆ Let's Hang - All Are Welcome!!

[Lemon Cheesecake]

they were clear here and the moon wasn't up yet - wait is it a new moon?

[Kyndreth]

Oh...?

[Lemon Cheesecake]

something, something, something

something about the moon or stars...
"This is the time of year when the dim Little Dipper (Ursa Minor) juts to the right from Polaris, the Little Dipper's handle-end during late evening. The much brighter Big Dipper curls over high above it, "dumping water" into it. They do the reverse in the fall."

[Polaris]

^^^ preserve all our old architecture and world wonders!!

Back when I visited Turkey, our tour guide told us that the Turkish government initially did not see the value in their ancient temples and ruins. So, the Turkish government allowed European archaeologists (primarily the British and the Germans) to excavate and literally deconstruct the temples there, only to set them back up again in European museums. E.g.: Pergamon Museum in Berlin literally took the temple of Pergamon, the Pergamon Altar, and a bunch of other stuff from the ancient city of Pergamon in Turkey back to Berlin.

As the saying goes: "You don't know what you have until it's gone" (Tourist Attractions + Tourists' Moolah)

[Kyndreth]

Oh boy.... why wouldn't they see how this kinda stuff would be valuable though? Then again, I suppose some of that would be cultural.

[chobi]

Well.. there's a whole lot more to ancient history than just some tourists looking at those things at museums but people seek profits... it's all about the money. And if it doesn't seem like it's all about the money, then it's all about the even bigger amounts of money.

Life forged by globalization and corporations aiming to get everything they want at lowest possible costs while abusing people is life that pushes us out of balance. Without the balance you can only "sit back and watch us as we spin out of control~ spin out of control~ try to recover but collide with each other we spin out of control~

Something I can't change
I was born in a place
that lives by the sword
And thus to it's blade we're condemned
Don't you understand why
We scream "No more" (no more)

My dreams are of children
Orphaned by blood
Spilled at these hands
And here on the graves of the innocent
we raise our flaag~ we

Spin out of control
Spin out of control
Try to recover but collide with each other we
Spin out of control

Some things you don't forgive some things you don't forget
Sometimes the fate you suffer is so much worse than death
We're way off course now and we're drifting off to sea
so cut the anchor on your heart to be set free ~ Set freeee ~ Set Freeeeee~

Spin out of control~
Spin out of control~
Spin out of controooool
Spin out of control
try to recover we have to recover
We fight and crash one after the other we
Spin out of control!"
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Rise against ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Kotov Syndrome~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[galled]

You can blame it on money, but it's really about stuff (power is a gatekeeper for stuff) and money is just the means to get control stuff. Humans are silly and greedy in many ways and it's a genetic feature built into us from millions of years of survival. We are programmed to want more and that programming has constructed us to be better survivors when in competition with others. We've eventually partially learned that being social extends our survival rates. But in the end, societies are made up of individuals and we default to our programmed basic nature if we're not thinking or feeling.

The movie "THE GODS MUST BE CRAZY" illustrates this very well. If you haven't seen it, I'll stick it in a spoiler.

[+] SPOILER

A coke bottle is discarded by a passing plane (garbage!) and lands in an isolated area of Africa and is found by some primitive people. It soon becomes an object of desire as it can be a useful tool, art object to behold, etc. and creates jealousy. And eventually a weapon. It breaks their society apart.

A real world example is the tulip craze in Holland. Or how about the latest fashion trends? People are crazy!!

The real question is how do we get each generation (or the current ones!) to get away from our animal instincts to benefit the greater good?

[Kyndreth]

Oh boy.... I like to simplify it to people suck and self-interest is one of the strongest motivators.

Society runs on self-interest~

[chobi]

Hey galled, what I was saying was not that money are bad but that people abuse power for money so they can have more power.

I've actually seen the gods must be crazy and it's nice movie to watch.

And it would seem that society runs on self interest, but I wonder, wouldn't it be better if we aimed for common interests that make life better for everyone?

[Kyndreth]

Heeeeh~

It would be better, but ideal is not reality~

[galled]

It definitely would be better for everyone. The point is humans are wired to want more than what everyone around them has. We know we shouldn't, but some can't control it. And that's what upsets the system. In THE GODS MUST BE CRAZY, everyone in the tribe had everything they needed. Basically everything in their world. It wasn't until one man got something that no one else had (and what everyone else wanted) that caused the unrest and problems.

Once you have everyone's basic needs taken care of, it's purely a psychological problem. "We want higher living standards!" and so on and so on.

STAR TREK envisions a world where everyone's needs are taken care of and that people will go on to do great things for the sake of doing things. Unfortunately, I think unless our animal instincts are kept in check, we'll have the same old same old... It's sad.

[Kyndreth]

I saaaay~

modify humans so they're less annoying?

[chobi]

I don't think that wanting more is a problem, but wanting more and achieving it by harming the people around you is bad. We should want more but for the good of all of us.

[Lemon Cheesecake]

with the war in the middle east and artifacts and historical monuments being destroyed, in some ways the fact that the treasures were moved to museums in other countries has actually ended up preserving them.

[chobi]

Well I'd love to go visit a lot of these places but not when there's so much war and angry people with guns looking for someone to shoot at...

Not that I could afford to travel to all these places but still ~ maybe soemday